Is MMI too powerful; if so what should be done?

[Earthmichael]

I think MMI is way too powerful for a single technology.  It gives Copters (which I like to ban anyway as being too powerful because of being the only non-land multi-attack unit), Thinker, Improves probe team morale, Drop pods, and two of the best SPs in the game: Cloudbase Academy and Cyborg Factory.

Must as I like to avoid twidling with the game unless it is really broken, I have noticed that many games become a race to MMI, and whoever wins this race wins the game.  Some people try to fix this by just banning CBA, which may be the best approach.  But another possibility might be to shift Cyborg Factory to a different tech.

Do you think banning copters and moving Cyborg Factory to another tech would be sufficient?  If so, which tech?

If not, do you favor banning CBA?

Or do you favor leaving things as they are?

[t_ras]

I don't like to ban compters.  somtimes they are the way of the weak to stay alive.
I do think that having CBa and CF in the same tech si too much.

[Yitzi]

My suggestions:
-Reduce copters' speed, increase their cost, improve AAA (which is far better against copters than SAM is.)
-Move thinker way up; I feel that weakening/delaying specialists is advantageous anyway because of the effects on crawler efficiency and base density.
-MMI is a very offensively military-focused tech, especially with thinkers moved and copters slightly weakened.  Thus, an important part of the fix is to shift focus more toward defensive and nonmilitary pursuits by having more than 2 players.  (With two players, conflict between the two is always beneficial to one, so whoever's stronger by even a bit will push conflict.  With more, a conflict between two players will often weaken them both, making defense have far more deterrent effect and military focus in general be less powerful.)  Best of all, that's not even twiddling with the game; it's playing the game as it was meant to be played.  (As an added bonus, it allows temporary alliances against one player who's getting too far ahead, which makes it a lot harder to end the game early.)

If you do want to move Cyborg Factory, Biomachinery seems a good choice.  (Unless you make easy pop booms impossible, in which case cloning vats are too much with anything else and a better choice might be Homo Superior.)

[t_ras]

Like the suggestions

[Green1]

Do not forget that Cloudbase Academy also shuts down air attacks by putting Aerospace Complex each base as well. Or the sattellite cheese if you have tons of orbital infrastructure.

Copters... well... I am a bit biased but I think all air needs the Civ 4 treatment. ie: Copters have one attack and jets have "missions" and not so much micro or "running out of fuel" if you are not careful.

[t_ras]

I think the "running out of fuel" is important to the game. Else jets would be too power full. Also, again, it is more realistic.

[Yitzi]

Do not forget that Cloudbase Academy also shuts down air attacks by putting Aerospace Complex each base as well.

Of course, the same can be done by building one in each base...it's just more expensive.

Keep in mind also that a good way to weaken those projects is to discourage the "lots of small bases" method; weakening specialists is a good idea for this (making it a double whammy against MMI), as is reducing recycling tanks to +1 nutrients (no minerals or energy).

Or the sattellite cheese if you have tons of orbital infrastructure.

Satellites are definitely a concern; I think the best approach is to shift them around so orbital defense pods (and thus the ability to shoot down satellites) are the first available and 2/3 the price, and sky hydroponics labs are available with or after Nessus mining stations, and both hydroponics labs and mining stations cost 50% extra.

Copters... well... I am a bit biased but I think all air needs the Civ 4 treatment. ie: Copters have one attack and jets have "missions" and not so much micro or "running out of fuel" if you are not careful.

Not really a feasible change without either the game source code or a huge amount of work, even by the standards of exe mods.  Reducing copter movement is a better approach.  (Also, while limiting copters to one attack by mechanics would be very difficult, house ruling it should be fairly easy if you want to go that route.)

I think the "running out of fuel" is important to the game. Else jets would be too power full.

Well, until gravships, which don't run out of fuel, but they're endgame units.