US Presidential Contenders

[Dio]

I enjoyed her style of humor. I did not necessarily agree with her political positions.

[Buster's Uncle]

You know?  She would probably be very good at that.  The woman has charm when she's not saying ignorant things about current events.

-I DO still wonder where she got that Wiscaaahnsin accident in Alaska, though.

[Rusty Edge]

http://www.thenation.com/article/rand-paul-made-some-of-the-few-sensible-points-of-the-whole-debate/  They offer an article presenting pretty much everything Paul said at the debate
in one easy to read package.

"Unlike [Sleezebag], Rand Paul Actually Made Some Sensible Points During the Debate

The Kentucky senator cut through the “childish, silly back-and-forth” to present reasonable alternatives on foreign policy, drug reform, and mass incarceration. "


"Paul distinguished  himself with coherent questioning of mass incarceration, calls for criminal-justice reform, and aggressive referencing of the injustices that extend from a failed drug war. The senator from Kentucky had one of the best moments of the debate when, during a back-and-forth over Jeb Bush’s youthful inhaling of marijuana, Paul put things into perspective for the former Florida governor: “Kids who have privilege like you do don’t go to jail. But the poor kids in the inner city still go to jail.”

And when the debate turned to foreign policy, Paul made more sense than the rest of the runners combined.

“I’ve made my career as an opponent of the Iraq War,” declared the senator, who reminded the crowd that “The Iraq War backfired and did not help us.”

There's much more, but you get the idea.

[Buster's Uncle]

Yeah; it may not have been enough, but he had a good night.

I really think a winning reaction to the Pig in the room is to be LESS pander-y; you'll never out-ignorant the actual ignoramus, so don't try. Be the grownup at the debates, and people will remember when they get serious about choosing.

[Rusty Edge]

Here's one from the Chicago Tribune.  I quoted the editorial excerpts, rather than Rand Paul, but they tie together rather nicely in the context of this article.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/kass/ct-kass-debate-wrapup-met-0918-20150917-column.html


"In debate showdown, Rand Paul the only adult on stage" by John Kass

Donald [Sleezebag] wanted to kick him off the debate stage. Fox News ignored him. CNN limited his time, then called him a loser.

But Rand Paul won the Republican presidential debate.


It wasn't even close.

Is he perfect, or some savior on a white horse? No. Yet the others on the debate stage talked like angry children determined to show the world how tough they'd be. They promised to rip up the Iran deal and either push Vladimir Putin around or ignore him completely.
 


But Paul, the senator from Kentucky, spoke like a thoughtful grown-up, overshadowing them all on foreign policy, explaining that intervening in Middle East civil wars is a recipe for disaster."

"The GOP establishment can afford a Carly Fiorina, pretending to be an outsider, or even a Marco Rubio, thrilling a few of the TV talking heads by morphing into some Leonidas of Sparta from Miami, eager to kick those insolent Persian envoys down the well.

But what the Republican establishment cannot afford is Paul as their nominee. That would expose the neocons and the war party, and the security surveillance state.
And it might help remind Americans that conservatives once opposed foreign adventures, meaning wars, because wars by definition lead to the aggrandizement of federal power.

It is the universal law of political arithmetic that as the government gorges and muscles up, individual liberty fades."

"Yet it was obvious from their flexing and posturing and saber rattling that the other Republicans insist on not learning a thing from Iraq.

And so, they'd love to face Hillary Clinton. She never met a war she didn't like.

If Hillary is in the finals with Jeb! or Rubio or even Fiorina — our new Joan of Arc who talked of building warships and recruiting brigades of U.S. Marines — the Republicans will be saved from having to confront their past."

*****************************************************

I'll let Rand Paul have the last word-

"Sometimes both sides of the civil war are evil, and sometimes intervention sometimes makes us less safe," Paul said. "This is the real debate we have to have in the Middle East.

"Every time we have toppled a secular dictator, we have gotten chaos, the rise of radical Islam, and we're more at risk. So I think we need to think before we act, and know most interventions, if not a lot of them in the Middle East, have actually backfired on us."

[vonbach]

Rand Paul is a sell out. Cnn and Fox can cheer lead for him all they like but
[Sleezebag] will flatten him. He isn't Ron Paul and his fathers supporters know it.

[Buster's Uncle]

I've thought he's pandered extensively in the past, and that was why I was so down on him - but this Rand the other night was acting like he was his father's son, talking what's sensible instead of what's popular.  I like the heck out of that.  I like integrity and I like guts.

[Rusty Edge]

vonbach-  Buncle and I have discussed that before, and have agreed that he's a sell-out, not the man his father was, not the disposition to be president. That's probably why he took a nose-dive in the polls.

I don't think he said the word Israel once all night.

With a field of 14 candidates- wouldn't it be great to have an alternative to NeoCons, TheoCons, and CEOCons?

....Well, wouldn't it?

Funny, I was looking for articles about the frontrunner and Carson and Carly post-debate, and sort of got side tracked when I saw Paul headlines. I had already written him off. During the debate I was looking for some of the others to break out of the pack, or slip and fall. I didn't appreciate Paul's remarks in the context of their entirety at the time.

After I posted that stuff last night I got an e-mail from Ron Paul asking me to donate to Rand. Since I respect Ron, since Rand is saying the right things once again, and since the GOP and the nation really needs to hear that message, I think I'll contribute.

[Buster's Uncle]

I respect and support that decision.  If things were otherwise, I might deplore it, but improvement and good behavior should be rewarded.

NeoCons, TheoCons, and CEOCons

We might have ourselves a real winner in that last.

[Buster's Uncle]

I had to take a cheap shot this morning for using "desperate hooker" in the same sentence with "McCain", and since the whole of what I think of the man has just not come up online in the years since I got a fast internet connection, in the same spirit as the saying something nice I'd always thought about Palin (and I left out that I totally agree that she's good-looking, in fact, the sexy librarian look is very much a favorite of mine) here's what I think of Senator McCain.

In the middle of the 2008 campaign that I'm so down on him for pandering so desperately throughout, he stopped an old lady who worked that Bakrama is a Muslim into a question at a town hall meeting, put his hand on the mic and quietly but firmly  said "He's not."  -That there weren't a bit pander-y; that was an honest man standing up to a lie when letting it pass would have served his goals.

In his concession speech, and this is at the heart of my admiration of the Senator, he said "He's my president and I support him."

Let's bold that and pump up the size a little.  That is gracious, that shows class and statesmanship, contrasted with much irrational outrage on the right the next day and ever since.  That was said because that's what a non-sore loser ought to, for the good of the country.  THAT -and the fellow at the town hall- is the Real John McCain, American Hero.

I disagree with him profoundly about many social conservative positions and clowns he supports, but cannot ignore what he's said and done about trying to reform a sick and corrupt political system in a life of public service.  Dude wants good government for me and everyone, not just his power base.  Period.

He's one of my senators, and I support him when he isn't wrong, which is frequently.  I respect him and admire him (which is why I'm so disappointed in and negative about McCain 2008 as opposed to McCain 2000 with the important exceptions I've noted here).  I think he's an extraordinarily good man, who thinks about problems in the system and tries to implement solutions.

He would have made a better president than either of the damaged goods who made it to the general election in 2000.

[vonbach]

vonbach-  Buncle and I have discussed that before, and have agreed that he's a sell-out, not the man his father was, not the disposition to be president. That's probably why he took a nose-dive in the polls.

Ron Paul went to the wailing wall thats enough.
If you had went to a foreign country to pander for votes in any other age you'd be looking at prison time.

here's what I think of Senator McCain.

Ah yes songbird McCain. Thats what the vets call him. He should be hung for treason.
Its well known that he cooperated with the enemy at that time.
He was also responsible for the USS Forestall fire that killed 167 people.
He had to be transferred to another ship to avoid getting lynched.
The only reason he wasn't hung is his daddy was an admiral.

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/07/21/john-sidney-mccain-iii-patriot-or-trader/

Had he not been the son and grandson of admirals, there is no chance he would have been accepted into the prestigious naval flight training program over far better qualified officers. On his way to becoming a North Vietnamese ace, the aviator lost 3 expensive aircraft on routine, non-combat flights. Little was made of all that, because he was, you know, the son and grandson of admirals.

John McCain’s most horrendous loss occurred in 1967 on the USS Forrestal. Well, not horrendous for him. The starter motor switch on the A4E Skyhawk allowed fuel to pool in the engine. When the aircraft was “wet-started,” an impressive flame would shoot from the tail. It was one of the ways young hot-shots got their jollies.

Investigators and survivors took the position that John McCain deliberately wet-started to harass the F4 pilot directly behind him. The cook off launched an M34 Zuni rocket that tore through the Skyhawk’s fuel tank, released a thousand pound bomb, and ignited a fire that killed the pilot plus 167 men. Before the tally of dead and dying was complete, the son and grandson of admirals had been transferred to the USS Oriskany.

John McCain’s 5½-year stay at the Hanoi Hilton (officially Hoa Loa Prison) has ever since been the subject of great controversy. He maintains that he was tortured and otherwise badly mistreated. One of many who disagree is Dennis Johnson, imprisoned at Hanoi and never given treatment for his broken leg.

He reports that every time he saw McCain, who was generally kept segregated, the man was clean-shaven, dressed in fresh clothes, and appeared comfortable among North Vietnamese Army officers. He adds that he frequently heard McCain’s collaborative statements broadcast over the prison’s loud speakers.

On October 26, 1967, John McCain’s A-4 Skyhawk was shot down over Hanoi. The fractures of 1 leg and both arms were reportedly due to his failure to tuck them in during ejection. According to U.S. News & World Report (May 14, 1973),

John McCain didn’t wait long before offering military information in return for medical care. While an extraordinary patient at Gi Lam Hospital, he was visited by a number of dignitaries, including, to quote John McCain himself, General Vo Nguyen Giap, the national hero of Dienbienphu.

[Buster's Uncle]

You just never cease to amaze, von.

[vonbach]

BTW he's also well known for being a lunatic. Literally insane. As in he starts screaming about nuking Russia
or Iran and throwing fax machines at staffers. He got on air once and started singing "Bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb Iran."
Its the reason he wont ever be allowed to be president.
Its simply too dangerous.

[Yitzi]

vonbach-  Buncle and I have discussed that before, and have agreed that he's a sell-out, not the man his father was, not the disposition to be president. That's probably why he took a nose-dive in the polls.

I don't think he said the word Israel once all night.

With a field of 14 candidates- wouldn't it be great to have an alternative to NeoCons, TheoCons, and CEOCons?

There is...unfortunately, Donald [Sleezebag] is arguably worse than any of those.

[Buster's Uncle]

Dumbocrats?