First PBEM - TTT

[Peter Gray]

We may vote on the Planetary Council resolution to enforce bilateral agreements as binding under one condition - those become ineffective after maximum 20 turns. So you can plan accordingly without being afraid of being back-stabbed but also without being forced to keep your word for 200 years. You know, alliances are fine but after some time situation can change and no one should be locked into permanent alliance or war. It would become boring in my opinion and the point of strategic games is to remain flexible and dynamic in your plans. What do other Planetary leaders think?

[Kurvivor]

What kind of enforcement are you talking about?

[Kirov]

Guys, I'm sorry, but joking aside, this is going way too far. There is absolutely no way I would ever agree to any kind of artificial enforcement of any kind of agreement, and it is end of story. If you can't stand the threat of being back-stabbed, this probably means that Multiplayer is simply not your cup of tea. It's totally fine, singleplayer is cool as well. Maybe you don't feel it right now because you just haven't played that much SMAC MP, but this proposal ruins like 75% fun of the game. There is definitely time and place for what I'd call "reasonable treachery" and the thrill of exposing to it, pulling it off or even falling victim to it is absolutely incomparable to anything you can experience in singleplayer. That's lovely that you don't want to betray, it's cool and I respect that. Honestly, I tend to be a man of my word myself. But sometimes I am not and that's when the real fun starts. You will have a couple of games more under your belt, you'll know I'm right. For now, please just trust me on this - if you don't want to be back-stabbed, you have to make sure it doesn't happen or just back-stab earlier. That's the only way it can work.

[MallaxOZ]

Totally agree. I would even say that I want to play MP games to lose, as I'm sick of easy wins against AI. Cause AI is too weak at surprising me. I almost want to be betrayed! And of course, I want to crush the traitor like a bug afterwards Or be annihilated if that's my fate...
I'm not against agreements or pacts (unless as I wrote in a previous post, if the pact is unfair and spoil the game), but I really don't think that we need any rule to frame them.

[Kirov, in case you've missed it, it's your turn.]

[Kirov]

Of course I missed it, sorry.

Kurvivor, what's the problem with Iniswap? Have you managed to enter the factions in the required order? I can send you a file with that. Also, it's worth using the Ini launcher (the blue face) for all your games and put it in your desktop or quicklaunch or wherever it is you start SMAC from. Then it's always one click more but all your games are good with graphics.

[MallaxOZ]

=> 

[Kurvivor]

Kurvivor, what's the problem with Iniswap?

Mainly, it seems to change contents of ini file without express actions to do so. For example: i want to verify i am using factions for this game, i launch iniswap, i look and am satisfied with 'factions in ini file' list. I close it and launch the game (cannot do it from there due to being on linux - it fails to start). Lo and behold! i am gaian and aliens are believers.

[Kirov]

Mainly, it seems to change contents of ini file without express actions to do so. For example: i want to verify i am using factions for this game, i launch iniswap, i look and am satisfied with 'factions in ini file' list. I close it and launch the game (cannot do it from there due to being on linux - it fails to start). Lo and behold! i am gaian and aliens are believers.

Iniswap is not supposed to work this way. The ini file in your game folder remains unchanged, it is only the faction list which gets temporarily altered. That's actually the entire point of Iniswap. If you can't use the Ini launcher, then I believe the app is no good for you. I'm quite sure I used to use Iniswap 1.0 and it run the terranx launcher, but you'd have to search for it.

[Mart]

Kurvivor, what's the problem with Iniswap?

Mainly, it seems to change contents of ini file without express actions to do so. For example: i want to verify i am using factions for this game, i launch iniswap, i look and am satisfied with 'factions in ini file' list. I close it and launch the game (cannot do it from there due to being on linux - it fails to start). Lo and behold! i am gaian and aliens are believers.

Are you using SMACX linux version, or is it windows version on WINE?

Iniswap was meant for windows. The first versions were replacing whole ini file, but it was not efficient, as other changes to ini were lost.
This recent 2.2 version replaces only 7 lines for factions, but that's true, launcher requires declaration of set to replace (could be skipped for better functionality, but I did not make that).

There is a chance, Yitzi will fix graphics bug for multiplayer in his next release. Singleplayer does not have that problem, it loads the strings with faction names from the save. I may be wrong, but it is possible, scient fixed this (or it was never broken...?)

Meanwhile, I make a Java version of iniswap.

[Kirov]

Vishniac, did you miss your turn? Now I'm thinking maybe you got upset...

[MallaxOZ]

Feel free to take your time: I'm going into vacation now.
You'll get my turn Tuesday evening.

Nope, he just took a break 

[Kirov]

Oh good, then. BTW - I'm away 22-24 (this weekend, Friday included).

[Vishniac]

Fine, no binding then. It was just a question.
Once in a MP game of Dominions III, I had a non-agression agreement for 8 turns and i attacked the guy after something like 10 turns: he squealed like a pig you try to kill, PMed the other players and swore about betrayal...
Here, the rules are clear now: no rules! 

To the Drones 

[Peter Gray]

I was wondering, why people seem to be breaking the silence between uncontacted factions? Like, asking me if I'm attacked by aliens or not?

EDIT: -> Morgan

[MallaxOZ]

why people seem to be breaking the silence between uncontacted factions?

Changing a line in some file make something hide the factions that you haven't encountered yet, even if it's a human player. So, no more pretending you can't talk with someone else, you really can't. It's useful, mostly when you're approaching a uncontacted faction, and you're not sure you're close enough to engage conversation.

It's has been posted in this thread I believe, but I don't recall at all...