Restricting economical growth

[bvanevery]

You can make a partial payment to avoid waste in high production bases.

And I thought activating a self-destruct sequence was the candidate for most obscure feature of the game.  This is so bureaucratically baroque that I'm not even going to comment on it.  Except to say I've never done this.

I suppose releasing mindworms into the wild might be considered obscure.

Turning over units or cities to other factions is a bit obscure, and exploitable, but I don't do that.  I've benefited plenty from AI units turned over to me though.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

What would be convenient is to have Hurry Button - just click and its done. No confirmation box, no numbers. You can set it to 100% (so waste some min) or as much as its needed + minerals (thats more complicated..) but nevertheless it would be quality of life. One can go through bases and just quickly click Hurry Hurry Hurry Hurry Hurry Hurry Hurry  until there's no more money and be done with it.

Allow governor to hurry production.
😁

[lolada]

Lol I'll see if i can put governors to some use - they will ruin bases likely ^^. I never use them.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

Good deal. I think we have a generic understanding and this thread served the purpose. I plan to lock it and we can discuss specific changes further on in main thread.

Summary

1.
Very end game production seems excessive and over the need for anything. This is mostly for last 1/4 of the game of even closer to the end. The rest of the game, including middle part is fine.

2.
Everybody seems to report that there is too much energy. There is no agreement on minerals. Some are for reducing them some are against. Nobody complained about nutrients.

Changes made so far
Condenser and Enricher do not multiply nutrients anymore.
Borehole could be slightly nerfed on energy or minerals or both.

Future changes
Reduce the cost of forest improving facilities since forest is not that great with 1-2-0 anymore.
Reduce the multiplicative coefficient for multiplying facilities of all kind (minerals, economy, labs, psych).
Correspondingly, reduce above facilities cost/maintenance as they are losing their effect partially.

[lolada]

1.Very end game production seems excessive and over the need for anything.

- Hm nope i don't feel mineral production is excessive at tech 10-11.. As i said its hard to get many bases above 50 minerals.. at least until you get those super projects. Good lategame units cost 140+ minerals.. so thats 3+ turns per unit for strong bases, weaken ones are 5-6-7. At that point when player converts everything to military production - its possible to overrun AI - but it takes a long time to get to that position. Maybe if you spam 10+ nexus mining satellites, but even that is limited by base size, and get all mineral boosting facilities then minerals would be too abundant.
If energy is counting as production then yes - one can rush a lot.. to the end of my AAR i had 15k+ energy credits - i didn't spend them all because i was too lazy to micro and had so many bases that i didn't have to.

2. Energy - yes too much - it makes tech go to fast. Induktio changed techs today or yesterday. And there's so much energy if you are winning (and you should) that its trivial to rush secret projects or multiple units each turn.

Nutrients - I dont have too much.. it balances itself.. when there's much early-mid you can't handle drones - so i just switch to mines/boreholes. Later on at some point there's lots of nutrients but bases grow slow. I didn't pop-boom in WTP.. i get bases up to 10-14.. there's no real need to build Habitation Domes. AI had tons of food due to condenser spam, but they can grow more due to their bonuses - now they won't have it.

Future changes
Reduce the cost of forest improving facilities since forest is not that great with 1-2-0 anymore.
Reduce the multiplicative coefficient for multiplying facilities of all kind (minerals, economy, labs, psych).
Correspondingly, reduce above facilities cost/maintenance as they are losing their effect partially.

- I forgot to reply to that suggestion on prices Tree/Hybrid forests - i guess we could do that.. especially if you nerf eco %
- I'd nerf ECO%.. as i said minerals are fine..
- Labs - Fusion Lab is 50/50 that could go 25/25.. Research hospital is 25 psych/50 labs - that could be 50 psych/25 labs
- Psych - hm you might be right about that - Its convenient to be able to go to +20% psych and solve lots of psych issues so it should not be too nerfed. Hologram Theater might go to +25% and have Research Hospital/Nanohospital at 50% (nerf science there) to make them more interesting for psych. I didn't use Tree/Hybrid forests  and i was fine - i don't think they even need psych bonus, its 50%.. that could be nerfed they would still be great. Forests are still extra resources, + eco + psych (if you place them at 25%) and reduce eco dmg by half - thats huge.

Something like that.. this could be calculated i suppose.. But for example i don't even build Quantum Labs for +50% science.. or Nanohospitals - because there's so much science/psych already.

[Nexii]

I took a better look at T-hawk's speed run. While a micro map isn't identical to a larger one, there aren't huge differences. I concluded it was more about raw production, specialists, and satellites. Those are the things to target moreso than facilities or SPs. Very few facilities were built and same with SPs, only the most powerful 9 or so.

Not everything can be at the end of the tech tree of course. But as I saw it the main culprit was getting all the terraforming options so early. Secondarily, the fact that specialists aren't affected by EFFIC is a bit ridiculous too. Though that would have had little impact on a micro map anyways.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

1.Very end game production seems excessive and over the need for anything.

- Hm nope i don't feel mineral production is excessive at tech 10-11..

That is what I said.

...
There is no agreement on minerals. Some are for reducing them some are against.
...

You are the one against.

Anyway, it's not like we want to be on a same page. I just gathered opinions. Variations are fine.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

2. Energy - yes too much - it makes tech go to fast.

This is easily fixable by adjusting research cost formula rather than struggling with energy production.