Hi, the internet is still dreadful but at least I can see this forum :) Hello guys.You are very welcome, thank you for partaking in the game!
Thanks for setting this up Jeroen. Like Eadee, I'd vote for the original seven factions but SMAX if poss. I've not played with Kyrub's patch before but I don't mind downloading it if that's the preferred.
I'd like to play Gaia please and if this does turn into one of your videos then I'm fine with "Misotu" on the splash screen.
With regard to passwords etc, do you think we might be able to ask someone to do a map for us as well as holding passwords? It's not that I want anything special in the way of a start, but it's really not much fun for a builder to find herself right on top of another human player (or one of the AI, come to that, especially if they're competent!)
And to ease it: I almost never played spartan before. Usually I play a builders game as Gaian or Hive against AI in Librarian difficulty. I don't think anyone has to be afraid of me.
I've played only two PBEM's by now (also hive and gaian), both with/against Jeroen and I just want to play santiago for some variety. :)
I understand about tension, truly, but sometimes the game does *really* dumb things. I fired up a game last night for fun and Morgan's HQ was situated six tiles away from Believer HQ (on a huge map too!). Guess what happened? :D :DYou had some peaceful negotiations :D ?
OK Eadee, I'm less concerned about the impact rovers rolling over the hill now :D I'm a rubbish militarist so that's a relief. I still don't want to be next door to you though ...If he tries anything, the U.N. will feel obliged to send its forces, surely.
Hi guys, I'm in but I'm like crazy busy these days and can't really focus my mind of SMAX. I can't even decide on the faction off the top of my head, sorry for that. It's 2v2, right? So we go against Sparta and the UN? How can we possibly challenge the UN Mandate defended by the iron fist of the Sparta regime? I want to surrender and start over already.Not technically a 2v2 but a game where alliances are encouraged. So if you want you can try to hook up with everybody. The only limitation (house rule) is that you cannot win with an alliance of more than 2 human players. Nobody is forced to ally, but if a player goes for the war path the other 3 can unite against this player.
What I really, really recommend is disabling the Empath Guild and Cloud-Base Academy. In my opinion, both are imbalanced for MP as eff. Do you guys accept any additional rules?I can see the problem with Cloud-Base, but not with Empath Guild.
Another thing would be cutting the power of choppers, either by capping their max attack or forbidding to attack bases.
And last thing, especially for 2v2, I'd recommend blind research. I know, I know, it's a random thing for beginners. Yes with the former, no with the latter. First and foremost, blind research prevents this lame-A thing when two factions get 2 techs at the price of 1 (by sharing 1 tech just before the other guy's breakthru). Secondly, it prevents the predictable beelines we all know and hate. Thirdly, it forces you to buy crap only so you don't have to research it. Fourthly, you're kinda forced to trade and/or probe. Sure it's random and there is a chance you end up with Field Mod instead of NLM, but for me, the pros outweigh the cons.I think blind research is the only real way to play this game! Actually I think it's beginners who disable it ;)
Not technically a 2v2 but a game where alliances are encouraged. So if you want you can try to hook up with everybody. The only limitation (house rule) is that you cannot win with an alliance of more than 2 human players. Nobody is forced to ally, but if a player goes for the war path the other 3 can unite against this player.
I can see the problem with Cloud-Base, but not with Empath Guild.
As far as choppers go... I think by the time choppers show up, and there is war, it is already a heavy air war with great casualties. I don't think choppers at this point really change much, they just speed up the game. I also just think with the right strategy you can make sure you can intercept or prevent choppers from attacking (air superiority, AAA, interceptors, SAM rovers, &c).
All in all I feel a bit uneasy about tampering too much with the rules... I actually like the 1998 roughness of it, it makes for exciting stories after the game, even if things end up not being fair. Cloud-Base is just a crazy thing, sure, but even then; say Eadee starts building Cloud-Base, why don't we all just team up and planet buster him? I mean to say; we can just agree as players that building Cloud-Base is an act of war?
I have changed the game version to SMAX, now we just need to figure out which patch.
Eadee and I know one-another, yeah, but we won't specifically team up because of it (maybe we won't because of it ;)). The house rule about victory is more to stop people from going 'let's all team up against the AI and build until turn 350' which, er, just feels a bit empty to me.Not technically a 2v2 but a game where alliances are encouraged. So if you want you can try to hook up with everybody. The only limitation (house rule) is that you cannot win with an alliance of more than 2 human players. Nobody is forced to ally, but if a player goes for the war path the other 3 can unite against this player.
Goes without sayin', mate. I can't imagine still alive SMAC players going 3 against 1 or even 3 against 2 if those 3 are good. We are all gentlemen and ladies here. :) Actually, it is my personal rule that I concede defeat only to one player if there are no pre-set alliances. Otherwise, 2 reasonable players early allied can dominate virtually any game, even a 5-player one. I don't need any specific house rule here, but let's have some class, saying to noone in particular as we all surely have it. ;) I have this impression that you two are friends so I thought I'm gonna look forward to ally with Misotu. If we want to truly start out neutral, let's stress it from the beginning. Of course, ganging up on the strongest one is a thing I'm always for.
Eh, eh, I suppose, but the EG costs about as much as six naval probe teams. I actually never really built it until a recent game and never needed.QuoteI can see the problem with Cloud-Base, but not with Empath Guild.
It's all about infiltration. It should be costly as hell and it's not for the one player who's got EG. A custom from 'poly times. I'm not gonna insist on everything I suggest so I can back down here but please do know I consider this Project super important and I'd definitely beeline to it if not for that pesky blind research (see how handy it comes already?)QuoteAs far as choppers go... I think by the time choppers show up, and there is war, it is already a heavy air war with great casualties. I don't think choppers at this point really change much, they just speed up the game. I also just think with the right strategy you can make sure you can intercept or prevent choppers from attacking (air superiority, AAA, interceptors, SAM rovers, &c).
AAA is off the basic tech lines, SAM rovers prove no resistance against the chop & drop strategy. I just wanted to avoid one of two inevitable things (1) aircraft slugfest, or (2) "I got D:AP/MMI first so I won this game, thank you very much".
Just recently we had a game when it was all strategic growth up to some point and then I threw the towel shortly after. There was literally no point in coming to the battlefield. As long as airpower is strong as it is, there are no super cunning tactical shenanigans you can employ, it's all about who can throw more aircraft at the front line. I'd like to see some use for navy besides exploration/scouting and for infantry besides airborne base taking. Let's talk about it more perhaps...?
- caught probing requires notifying the victim; fair enough, but the issue we discussed here on this board - do you have to say why we have vendetta now? Can you play dumb about it? (the replies here were inconclusive to me but I got this impression that people think it's okay that I tell you 'uh oh, we have vendetta now' and then pretend I don't know why)- You have to say vendetta because of probe team actions. (That way if you try to frame someone and it backfires they won't know you tried to frame them, only that you used probe teams somewhere.)
- please tell me about the bugs about tiles in the fog of war; I thought I know most of them, but not these
- first time I hear about 'suspicion towards a player going rogue'; how do we go about that? what do you have in mind?
I think it's worth discussing the rules a bit since every PBEM is quite a big investment in time, but I'm keen to get up and running!Well, I don't need a big discussion, I'm a low-maintenance player, I can adapt to almost any rules you people want.
Empath Guild: I've never built this in an MP game, but a recent PBEM showed me exactly why many people like to ban it. Of course, it's only really the same as Planetary Governor, which is similarly over-powered!I think I lost my last game against Jeroen also because of the Empath Guild, no reason for me to ban it, but if you two insist on doing so, and I abstain... Jeroen, they got a majority.
Blind research: Frustrating as hell but it makes MP so much more interesting so I'm happy with that even though I never get IA or MMI if there's any other possibility whatsoever :DThe RNG for random research screwed me as well pretty hard last game, but I think you all are probably far more expierienced players. And YOU will screw me over for SURE if we turn blind research off.
Cloudbase: I agree with banning it, for the reasons given, and I'm fine with no choppers against bases too.I don't even remember what it does (airbase in every city I guess?). So since I abstain and you two vote it out. Leave it out.
Patch: I have Yitzi installed too and find it very good. It hasn't caused me any problems running the game either.Ok, seems everyone can go with Yitzi's patch. Sounds good to go.
Thanks for the clarification on fog of war. I didn't understand that either and am happy to confirm that I won't do it now I know what it is :DSame for me.
I'd rather keep the game to four players if possible, just for turn rate.At this point I'm more afraid of the duration this pre-game-discussion will take if we take in another player or two.
I saw that you said that if you send another player a PM you have to notify them that you've done so but I'm puzzled about how to do that - does that mean you have to announce a PM on the turn tracking thread? Or have I completely misunderstood?The game pop-ups for communication between players is simply not reliable. If you send someone a message without making an offer, the other player won't be noticed at all. Its just smarter to inform someone if you sent an ingame-message so they do not miss it for several turns until you wonder why noone replies.
I assume that communicating with other players before contact in-game is prohibited?No ingame communication before meeting the other players faction (or buying their comlink frequencies or stuff), correct. Casual conversation outside of the game without naming details is fine.
And one more thing - the Thinker difficulty?Well, usually I play on Librarian difficulty. I'm fine with going up to thinker, but if we go to transcend I might get pretty annoyed by all those drones that pop up. Since the majority of factions will be player-factions I don't think it will make the game "too easy" for anyone to enjoy it.
And one thing more - I know a player who's committed to fast turnover - Vishniac. If we want a 5-some, he'll be doing his turns within 24 hours. Putting it out there just in case.See my answer to Misotu, I'm really more afraid of extended discussion over game rules then about the turns/day. So if he is picky about the rules I'd like to decline kindly, if he can go with almost anything like me, then I'm fine with it.
I think I lost my last game against Jeroen also because of the Empath Guild, no reason for me to ban it, but if you two insist on doing so, and I abstain... Jeroen, they got a majority.
I saw that you said that if you send another player a PM you have to notify them that you've done so but I'm puzzled about how to do that - does that mean you have to announce a PM on the turn tracking thread? Or have I completely misunderstood?Probably better if you send it to them via some private message if you want to keep it a secret you sent it. The interface only takes 3 lines of text so it should not take too much space.
Mentioning no names, but you know who you are Kirov ;lol ;lol ;lol
Guys, I must say your impatience puzzles me. This is SMAC PBEM, for god's sake. No matter your turnover, before we finish this, Donald [Sleezebag] will have been on all dollar bills of all nominations. The other game we've finished recently was started in May 2013. ;) Of course, you can count on me, however, I have to start with saying I'm away this weekend.You'll have to excuse me and Eadee, we are young and need our time for being up to no good!
The only real faction choice is Morgan, so let it be. Please don't beat me up.OK, I have set you as Morgan. May I ask what is your timezone? That's just for my mental safe-keeping.
You'll have to excuse me and Eadee, we are young and need our time for being up to no good!
OK, I have set you as Morgan. May I ask what is your timezone? That's just for my mental safe-keeping.
Also, since I am making a video of this, may I refer to you as Kirov inside the game/text? That way players might know should we ever play again or... find out who that six planet buster legend is.
I'm really more afraid of extended discussion over game rules then about the turns/day. So if he is picky about the rules I'd like to decline kindly, if he can go with almost anything like me, then I'm fine with it.Your game, your rules.
I deny everything! I have nothing to hide, but how much will there be in the videos? Is it one video after we're done or are you going to upload something while we still play and we're supposed not to watch? How much do you want for not showing my true colours to the world? Is it in Euros? And it was only one teeny tiny planet buster!
Delighted that you think of me but you should send a PM if you want to be sure I take part into the discussion.This is more like the U.N. every day! ;lal;
Only one thing: be sure to give Yitzi’s patch number we’ll use. I play currently on 3.4 but he released 3.4b this month.
Five human players should dissuade certain players from putting planet busters on rovers at turn 1. I for one selflessly pledge to obliterate warlords for the safety of all.Don't forget to read my signature!
Is it OK if in the videos I refer to you as Vishniac, or do you prefer a different name?Vishniac is ok, pronounced Vishniak
I for one selflessly pledge to obliterate warlords for the safety of all.
Referring back to the set-up, obviously I like abundant native life because it makes the game so much fun and I have no idea why "balance" would be affected :scratch: Mindworms make great pets you know: affectionate, intelligent and a very gratifying growth rate.
Also I don't want to give you the wrong idea about Kirov and his busters. They were very nice busters with nice manners and he was very apologetic about building them. I probably shouldn't have nicked the WP. Or tried to transcend :) Kirov is usually very friendly and only cuts up rough if people try to win. So don't worry.
Really a random map? This can bite us.More than you can think: I ran a game yesterday with our parameters (large map, 7 original factions, thinker) to see how it works.
Thus a repealling of the UN charter appears unavoidable! 8)
Really a random map? This can bite us.More than you can think: I ran a game yesterday with our parameters (large map, 7 original factions, thinker) to see how it works.
In 2215 of course my University is leading in tech and I built most of SPs but...I and all others AI are only at 50% of the Believers' powergraph.
First in population: Miriam
First in territory: Miriam
First in military: Miriam
PS Kirov is not a mass murderer, I can vouch for that. When he turned up with six planet busters and assorted launch pads I very sensibly put the happy little lives of my populace first and conceded.Who knows? Perhaps if I'd carried on he would have said "fair enough, we Poles are too honourable to have mass murder on our consciences. Can I do anything to help you transcend faster dear Misotu?"
And then again, he might just have obliterated my six best cities. I guess we'll never know ;cute
Okay, since Jeroen is not online in Skype, here's the .sav
I'm actually so desperate for ressources that I consider sending my colony-pod into a unity-pod at this point -.-
Please send your passwords to BU.BU or the one Jeroen told us?
Errr, I don't really know how to put it and not sound a bit stern, but... maybe you shouldn't tell people about any of this and just play the turn the way you see best? I'm not sure why you are telling us any of this :-\
I mean, you're kind-of giving away your secret information and now I know more about your faction than I think is fun to know.
Eh, so what happened here was; Kirov does have the battle ogre and he spawned right next to my faction; and then he and I disagreed quite a bit about whether that was a problem that needed to be addressed or not.
I think given the circumstances next turn I get I'll remove myself from the game; to be honest the whole discussion took away the suspense of the game for me. That's just my problem though, and I am a bit of a guest here at the forums; so I don't want to step on any toes by lording it over people and demanding different playstyles. So I'll remove myself from the game, that will allow Kirov to play on as normal and shouldn't impact it much at this early stage.
I think there wouldn't have been a problem if lal got eliminated, he'd probably just get an escape pod to start over.
I think there wouldn't have been a problem if lal got eliminated, he'd probably just get an escape pod to start over.
His logic was the same. But who said anything about early elimination? You put a tight noose on the last remaining base or two and only break the neck when it's too late for respawn anyway. I think it's hard-coded at 2200, and even if it's not, restart at 2200 makes you as important to global events as the AI. I wonder how you can make an exciting video out of this. ;)
Jeroen I don't know how you do it. I think it may actually be worse ... ;lol Not a single 2 food square, no river, no specials ... nothing.Just reroll that pod *cough* I'm sure noone will notice ;)
And the pod didn't give me anything either. On the up-side, it didn't actually attack me :D
I think Eadee and I just have a slightly larger roleplay-esque "against all the odds" fever.Then take that! 8)
Ah well. It can't just be me.
I am sure Kirov will come over the horizon with his 10-10-10 ogres any time soon.
Bugger. You know, I have not one but *two* faction HQs within breathing distance ...
Why me? I *love* Planet with all my Gaian heart. Why do you do this to me? :broken sobs off:
Kirov the Bloodthirsty Capitalist there folks ;lol
THIS IS SPARTAAAA!you see why I NEED the borehole cluster?
you see why I NEED the borehole cluster?
To the CEO! ;morgan;
The Believers topped the Gaians... :-\
The powergraph shows a rapidly evolving situation. We are monitoring this with attention.